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Is a Christian Rite of Passage a GOOD Idea for Boys? With Author Steven Arms

When David Arms was young his father's absence and lack of involvement leaves him unsure of his manhood. As a father he decided to do something different with his sons. A new tradition is born, and lives are changed. We take a look into what we have ...


When David Arms was young his father's absence and lack of involvement leaves him unsure of his manhood. As a father he decided to do something different with his sons. A new tradition is born, and lives are changed. We take a look into what we have lost from times gone by and what we might should reinstate from the eyes of a Father and Son.

"It's every father's responsibility to tell his son at the appropriate age: 'Son, I just want you to know I no longer consider you to be a boy, but in my eyes, I see you as a man now. And that if every father in this country did that for their sons, then this country and this world would be a much better place because boys would not need to prove their manhood to anybody else.'" – Steven Arms

Steven Arms is the co-author of the book Milestone to Manhood: A Father and Son's Journey to a Meaningful Rite of Passage. He is an advocate for meaningful rites of passage in modern Western culture, having experienced the positive impact of his own rite of passage as a 13-year-old boy. Stephen Arms was born and raised in California, and moved to Oregon to pursue a relationship with his future wife. A father of two, he was always interested in understanding how things work and pushing his body to its limits. We dive into rites of passage, which his father had organized for him when he was 13. This meaningful event gave Stephen confidence in his identity, and provided the trust and security needed to share his doubts and questions with his father when he was in college. Thanks to this rite of passage, Stephen was able to find his faith again and continue his path to becoming a virtuous, masculine man.

We look at and discuss how Rites of Passage could impact men for the better in modern society. Do rights of passage have a place in modern society?

In this episode, you will learn the following:

1. What is the importance of a rite of passage in modern Western culture?

2. What does it mean to be a man in a boy's life?

3. How can a rite of passage positively shape a boy's masculine identity and faith?

4. Is this something to consider with your sons or daughters?

Resources: https://www.milestonetomanhood.com/

 

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Transcript

1 00:00:00,510 --> 00:00:03,030 Steven, what is the most important takeaway you want people to 2 00:00:03,030 --> 00:00:04,019 hear from this show today? 3 00:00:06,120 --> 00:00:09,900 The most important takeaway that I want people to take away from this 4 00:00:09,900 --> 00:00:15,210 show is that in the absence of Rite of Passage, boys are gonna prove their 5 00:00:15,210 --> 00:00:20,430 manhood to themselves, and that's why it's every father's responsibility, 6 00:00:20,750 --> 00:00:25,440 because he is the primary example of what it means to be a man in a boy's. 7 00:00:26,220 --> 00:00:30,540 It's every father's responsibility to tell his son at the appropriate age. 8 00:00:30,900 --> 00:00:35,580 Son, I just want you to know I no longer consider you to be a boy, but 9 00:00:35,580 --> 00:00:40,110 in my eyes, I see you as a man now, and that if every father in this country 10 00:00:40,115 --> 00:00:44,519 did that for their sons, then this country and this world would be a much 11 00:00:44,525 --> 00:00:49,050 better place because boys would not need to prove their manhood to anybody. 12 00:00:50,700 --> 00:00:51,000 Here's 13 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:52,290 the million dollar question. 14 00:00:52,770 --> 00:00:56,460 How do men like us reach our full potential and grow into the men we 15 00:00:56,460 --> 00:01:00,600 dream of being while taking care of our responsibilities, working, 16 00:01:00,780 --> 00:01:05,280 being good husbands, fathers, and still take care of ourselves? 17 00:01:06,150 --> 00:01:07,800 That's the question in this podcast. 18 00:01:08,145 --> 00:01:09,435 We'll help you with those answers. 19 00:01:09,435 --> 00:01:12,585 My name is Brent and welcome to the Fallible Man Podcast. 20 00:01:12,615 --> 00:01:14,505 Welcome to the Fallible Man Podcast, your home for all 21 00:01:14,505 --> 00:01:16,005 things, man, husband, and father. 22 00:01:16,275 --> 00:01:17,535 Big shout out to the Fallible Nation. 23 00:01:17,535 --> 00:01:20,055 You guys make these podcasts possible and a warm welcome 24 00:01:20,060 --> 00:01:21,525 to our first time listeners. 25 00:01:22,035 --> 00:01:25,125 My name is Brent, and today my special guest is author, father, 26 00:01:25,125 --> 00:01:26,925 and advocate, Steven Arms. 27 00:01:26,930 --> 00:01:28,875 Stephen, welcome to the show. 28 00:01:29,475 --> 00:01:30,035 Brent. 29 00:01:30,035 --> 00:01:31,155 Thank you so much for having me. 30 00:01:32,205 --> 00:01:34,895 Now, Steven, I'm not into big intros because. 31 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,520 I get to research you before the show, but accolades don't mean a 32 00:01:38,520 --> 00:01:39,900 lot of things to our listeners. 33 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:43,830 So in your own words, today, in this moment, who is 34 00:01:43,835 --> 00:01:44,880 Stephen Arm Wright? 35 00:01:46,410 --> 00:01:47,070 Absolutely. 36 00:01:47,250 --> 00:01:48,763 So, my name is Stephen Arms. 37 00:01:48,823 --> 00:01:53,383 I am a husband and a father and a follower of Christ. 38 00:01:54,013 --> 00:01:56,503 I was born and raised in California. 39 00:01:56,743 --> 00:01:58,843 I spent the first 25 years of my life. 40 00:01:59,803 --> 00:02:04,823 And then met my beautiful bride to be when I was 25 years old and moved up to 41 00:02:04,823 --> 00:02:07,283 Oregon to pursue my relationship with her. 42 00:02:07,523 --> 00:02:13,283 And we were married in 2018, and now we have two beautiful children. 43 00:02:13,313 --> 00:02:19,193 Our daughter is three years old and our son is one, just about turn two here. 44 00:02:19,283 --> 00:02:20,993 So we definitely have our hands full. 45 00:02:21,060 --> 00:02:26,236 But having children is a blessing and I consider myself to be a, a. 46 00:02:26,881 --> 00:02:28,201 Wealthy man in that regard. 47 00:02:29,671 --> 00:02:31,591 Steven, can I ask, what do you, what do you do for a living 48 00:02:31,591 --> 00:02:31,981 right now? 49 00:02:33,211 --> 00:02:33,931 Professionally? 50 00:02:33,931 --> 00:02:37,594 I actually work as an engineer in the heating and air conditioning business. 51 00:02:37,684 --> 00:02:38,734 Okay, okay. 52 00:02:38,764 --> 00:02:39,064 Yeah. 53 00:02:39,754 --> 00:02:41,074 Engineering is a feet, man. 54 00:02:41,074 --> 00:02:43,384 There's, it's a lot to that, so. 55 00:02:44,404 --> 00:02:44,854 Wow. 56 00:02:44,884 --> 00:02:45,394 Absolutely. 57 00:02:45,394 --> 00:02:45,514 Yeah. 58 00:02:45,574 --> 00:02:50,644 I think, you know, God gave me this, you know, kind of technical I mind, I'm always 59 00:02:50,644 --> 00:02:52,264 trying to think about how things work. 60 00:02:52,864 --> 00:02:53,944 How to take things apart. 61 00:02:53,974 --> 00:02:56,314 I, you know, I've been like that ever since I was a kid. 62 00:02:56,344 --> 00:03:01,864 Legos were all I ever wanted from about four years old to probably 14 63 00:03:01,869 --> 00:03:05,254 years old, is if you just got me Legos for Christmas, I was a happy boy. 64 00:03:06,124 --> 00:03:06,244 My 65 00:03:06,244 --> 00:03:08,854 daughters are getting more and more into Legos. 66 00:03:09,274 --> 00:03:10,384 I have to keep reminding them. 67 00:03:10,384 --> 00:03:16,294 It's like, okay, if I step on one, it's going in the trash . So, mind, 68 00:03:16,324 --> 00:03:19,264 mind your sets, they're, they're get starting to put together the pre-built 69 00:03:19,264 --> 00:03:20,884 sets that you see at the store. 70 00:03:21,424 --> 00:03:21,784 Yeah. 71 00:03:22,239 --> 00:03:23,779 And Lego is proud of those. 72 00:03:23,779 --> 00:03:24,199 Wow. 73 00:03:26,359 --> 00:03:28,939 . Steven, I, I like to get to know our guests. 74 00:03:28,939 --> 00:03:30,769 So tell us something just absurd. 75 00:03:30,774 --> 00:03:31,159 You like to 76 00:03:31,159 --> 00:03:33,979 do something absurd. 77 00:03:33,984 --> 00:03:37,392 I like to do I love to work out, so I actually kind of 78 00:03:37,397 --> 00:03:40,182 built out my garage into a gym. 79 00:03:40,295 --> 00:03:43,505 And I'm really into rowing and cycling. 80 00:03:43,685 --> 00:03:46,145 I also, I have this machine, it's called a ski. 81 00:03:46,985 --> 00:03:50,330 So it mimics the cross-country skiing motion. 82 00:03:50,330 --> 00:03:52,389 Really gets your core, your triceps. 83 00:03:53,139 --> 00:03:58,389 And actually, last year I set the world record in the hundred 84 00:03:58,394 --> 00:04:01,029 kilometers on the, the skier. 85 00:04:01,179 --> 00:04:03,536 It's it's about a six and a half hour event. 86 00:04:04,106 --> 00:04:07,406 But I saw the record posted online and I was like, you know what? 87 00:04:07,406 --> 00:04:08,816 I think I could beat that. 88 00:04:08,816 --> 00:04:13,646 So one day I woke up woke up at 5:00 AM was on the skier by 6:00 89 00:04:13,646 --> 00:04:18,038 AM and then by about noon that day, I was a world record holder. 90 00:04:18,098 --> 00:04:19,838 My wife said, you're crazy. 91 00:04:19,838 --> 00:04:21,368 I don't know why you do this kind of stuff. 92 00:04:21,368 --> 00:04:23,378 And I was like, well, I'm not gonna argue with you. 93 00:04:23,378 --> 00:04:24,158 I am crazy. 94 00:04:24,158 --> 00:04:25,830 But I just, I love that kind of stuff. 95 00:04:25,830 --> 00:04:30,900 I love pushing my body and trying to test the limits of what I can do Physic. 96 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:32,340 Okay. 97 00:04:32,340 --> 00:04:32,670 Wow. 98 00:04:32,670 --> 00:04:34,170 That's, that's very cool, man. 99 00:04:34,170 --> 00:04:35,280 World record holder. 100 00:04:36,750 --> 00:04:37,230 It's funny. 101 00:04:37,230 --> 00:04:37,440 Thank you. 102 00:04:37,620 --> 00:04:39,900 It's funny that people, people don't think about things like 103 00:04:40,140 --> 00:04:45,390 there's somebody who has a record in almost everything you do, right? 104 00:04:45,470 --> 00:04:45,960 Yeah. 105 00:04:45,965 --> 00:04:49,815 We, we like to measure those accomplishments, so, I never would've 106 00:04:49,815 --> 00:04:50,865 thought of doing it in the ski yard. 107 00:04:50,865 --> 00:04:54,105 And I've been on one of those once and I really would not do six hours on it. 108 00:04:54,105 --> 00:04:54,675 You are crazy 109 00:04:55,250 --> 00:05:00,245 just, yeah, I, I saw all the records for the shorter events, you know, the 2000 110 00:05:00,250 --> 00:05:04,095 meters, the 5,000 meters, and it was like, I'm nowhere close to those times, 111 00:05:04,545 --> 00:05:08,415 but once you start getting that to the hundred K, then a lot of people aren't 112 00:05:08,415 --> 00:05:10,285 interested in, in competing that anymore. 113 00:05:10,285 --> 00:05:11,265 So I was like, you know what? 114 00:05:11,415 --> 00:05:11,985 I think I can do. 115 00:05:13,035 --> 00:05:14,415 That's because that's a special 116 00:05:14,415 --> 00:05:15,375 brand of torture. 117 00:05:15,585 --> 00:05:15,795 That's 118 00:05:16,665 --> 00:05:17,025 . Yeah. 119 00:05:17,115 --> 00:05:18,315 Well, you said absurd, right? 120 00:05:18,315 --> 00:05:18,975 That's absurd. 121 00:05:19,005 --> 00:05:19,485 That is. 122 00:05:19,485 --> 00:05:19,935 That is, 123 00:05:20,295 --> 00:05:21,705 but that's a very cool fact. 124 00:05:22,155 --> 00:05:25,645 Steven, what purchase of a hundred dollars or less have you made in the 125 00:05:25,650 --> 00:05:26,775 last year this had the most impact 126 00:05:26,775 --> 00:05:27,345 on your life? 127 00:05:29,235 --> 00:05:31,005 Well, I'm gonna stretch the limits. 128 00:05:31,005 --> 00:05:36,288 I actually just bought a a new Garmin it's type, kind of like a Fitbit watch. 129 00:05:37,498 --> 00:05:41,988 It was 150 bucks, but they do have a $99 model, so I could 130 00:05:41,988 --> 00:05:42,898 have got the cheaper one. 131 00:05:42,949 --> 00:05:45,739 But what I love about this is that it'll track your sleep. 132 00:05:45,739 --> 00:05:49,729 So it'll tell you, you know, how many hours of REM sleep you got, and then 133 00:05:49,729 --> 00:05:51,919 it'll also track your resting heart rate. 134 00:05:51,949 --> 00:05:58,143 So if if I'm going through a cold or, you know, if I've had covid a couple times now 135 00:05:58,230 --> 00:06:02,130 it'll show you, you know, how your resting heart rate increases when you're sick. 136 00:06:02,134 --> 00:06:05,958 I, I love that kind of data, you know, being able to track my, my 137 00:06:05,958 --> 00:06:07,468 heart rate and my sleep quality. 138 00:06:07,497 --> 00:06:10,737 So for me, that's been a really cool purchase that I've got in the last year. 139 00:06:10,977 --> 00:06:11,157 It's 140 00:06:11,157 --> 00:06:13,167 like you have an engineering mind or something. 141 00:06:13,172 --> 00:06:15,237 Data weird. 142 00:06:16,167 --> 00:06:17,247 . So weird. 143 00:06:17,293 --> 00:06:18,253 I, I laugh. 144 00:06:18,643 --> 00:06:21,981 One of my best friends is a I'm not even sure what the right word is. 145 00:06:22,281 --> 00:06:25,371 He's in a software. 146 00:06:26,831 --> 00:06:30,246 and so like he lives on data, dude, like he's, he's got three watches 147 00:06:30,246 --> 00:06:34,236 strapped to him and he is got things monitoring everything and there 148 00:06:34,236 --> 00:06:35,616 is never too big of a data set. 149 00:06:35,616 --> 00:06:37,356 He'll data data, right? 150 00:06:37,416 --> 00:06:37,776 Yeah. 151 00:06:38,556 --> 00:06:41,466 It's like, oh, engineers, I know these people. 152 00:06:41,466 --> 00:06:41,976 Yes. 153 00:06:42,306 --> 00:06:43,086 Yeah, that's 154 00:06:43,086 --> 00:06:43,806 very cool. 155 00:06:44,316 --> 00:06:45,726 Now guys, it's just how we're wired, man. 156 00:06:45,726 --> 00:06:47,346 It's just the way that God made us 157 00:06:48,906 --> 00:06:51,896 guys, we're going to spend some time. 158 00:06:52,431 --> 00:06:55,191 Understanding what this conversation is really about as 159 00:06:55,191 --> 00:06:56,631 we get into rights of passage. 160 00:06:56,991 --> 00:06:59,031 But for a minute, I want to have a hardhearted with you 161 00:06:59,031 --> 00:07:00,921 guys and just share with you. 162 00:07:01,851 --> 00:07:03,621 A little something special from our new sponsor. 163 00:07:03,651 --> 00:07:06,501 One thing I usually don't share is how impactful the podcast 164 00:07:06,501 --> 00:07:07,611 has been for me personally. 165 00:07:08,241 --> 00:07:11,241 There's a lot I love and appreciate because I have the podcast. 166 00:07:11,541 --> 00:07:13,791 I become somebody who can approach people easier. 167 00:07:13,821 --> 00:07:16,221 I have a better network of people to call upon when I need 'em. 168 00:07:16,671 --> 00:07:20,361 I get to meet new people all the time from all walks of life and all over the 169 00:07:20,361 --> 00:07:24,811 globe and connect with 'em at a deeper level, and I have a voice to do what I. 170 00:07:25,596 --> 00:07:29,196 I'm always put into situations where I'm having to stretch and learn something new. 171 00:07:29,496 --> 00:07:32,196 I've really grown as a person and a professional since I started doing 172 00:07:32,196 --> 00:07:36,066 my podcast, and that was even before my show really started growing. 173 00:07:36,996 --> 00:07:40,296 I hired a company called Grow Your Show, who's our sponsor, by the way, 174 00:07:40,896 --> 00:07:42,156 and I wanted to share them with you. 175 00:07:42,636 --> 00:07:45,366 The owner, Adam, has one of the very best podcasts for teaching 176 00:07:45,366 --> 00:07:46,746 you how to be a podcaster. 177 00:07:47,196 --> 00:07:48,396 I honestly wish I had found it. 178 00:07:49,506 --> 00:07:52,686 One thing that they've done to help me is to bring me to a much larger 179 00:07:52,686 --> 00:07:55,836 listener base so that my voice is being heard around the world. 180 00:07:56,346 --> 00:07:59,796 There's a good chance, in fact that they helped us connect, but they 181 00:07:59,796 --> 00:08:01,776 also do editing and post-production. 182 00:08:02,316 --> 00:08:05,676 They can even help you launch and start your podcast, which could 183 00:08:05,681 --> 00:08:08,766 really help you in your business or whatever you're trying to achieve. 184 00:08:09,666 --> 00:08:11,376 So I just wanted to give them a quick shout out. 185 00:08:11,466 --> 00:08:15,486 I love to share great people and companies that I believe in, that I use personally. 186 00:08:16,191 --> 00:08:18,891 So that's Grow Your show@growyourshow.com. 187 00:08:19,221 --> 00:08:22,641 I have a link in the show notes and if you have a podcast or you wanna start 188 00:08:22,641 --> 00:08:25,911 a podcast or you're thinking about it, just scroll down there, click that 189 00:08:25,911 --> 00:08:28,011 link and go work with my friend Adam. 190 00:08:28,191 --> 00:08:29,151 He's gonna treat you right. 191 00:08:29,211 --> 00:08:30,621 All right guys, thanks for bearing with us. 192 00:08:30,651 --> 00:08:32,301 I love Grow Your show. 193 00:08:32,361 --> 00:08:34,131 Adam and his team are amazing. 194 00:08:34,731 --> 00:08:37,851 They are company with incredible integrity, so thanks for 195 00:08:37,851 --> 00:08:40,731 listening and check them out if you're interested in podcasting. 196 00:08:41,151 --> 00:08:44,121 Now, Steven, for people who aren't familiar with the. 197 00:08:45,141 --> 00:08:47,001 What is a rite of passage? 198 00:08:48,321 --> 00:08:53,661 So in our context, a rite of passage is an event that a boy can look 199 00:08:53,661 --> 00:08:58,371 back on in his life and know that was the moment that I became a man. 200 00:08:59,091 --> 00:09:03,171 When we look at other cultures, we see these rights of passage around the age 201 00:09:03,201 --> 00:09:05,481 of 13, these coming of age ceremonies. 202 00:09:05,991 --> 00:09:09,021 The most well known is probably the Jewish Bar Mitzvah. 203 00:09:09,411 --> 00:09:13,701 That's the ceremony and the Jewish faith where a boy can achieve the status of. 204 00:09:14,721 --> 00:09:20,466 Another example would be the the walkabout in aboriginal Australian society. 205 00:09:21,036 --> 00:09:27,066 And in that rite of passage, a boy is sent off into the wilderness for three to six 206 00:09:27,066 --> 00:09:29,586 months at a time to survive on his own. 207 00:09:30,066 --> 00:09:33,966 And when he comes back, he's no longer considered to be a boy, but 208 00:09:33,966 --> 00:09:37,266 he's considered to be a man of the tribe and he's eligible for marriage. 209 00:09:38,046 --> 00:09:44,676 And modern Western society doesn't really have an equivalent coming of age event. 210 00:09:45,186 --> 00:09:51,306 And so that's one reason why our family in this book, we advocate for fathers to 211 00:09:51,306 --> 00:09:53,976 hold a right of passage for their sons. 212 00:09:54,696 --> 00:09:54,966 Okay. 213 00:09:55,406 --> 00:09:56,376 And guys, just 214 00:09:56,856 --> 00:09:59,886 so I, I didn't throw it out there right at the beginning, we're 215 00:09:59,886 --> 00:10:02,766 actually gonna be talking about milestone to manhood, and we're gonna 216 00:10:02,766 --> 00:10:04,536 get deeper into the book as we go. 217 00:10:05,091 --> 00:10:08,451 But I just wanna set the stage because you need to understand the 218 00:10:08,451 --> 00:10:12,531 core behind what this is, because the book is about a Christian rite 219 00:10:12,531 --> 00:10:16,851 of passage for 13 year old boys, and it's incredible as a great blueprint. 220 00:10:17,301 --> 00:10:19,611 Like I said, we'll tell you more about it as we go, but we gotta 221 00:10:19,611 --> 00:10:21,291 understand the basis of it. 222 00:10:21,801 --> 00:10:27,501 Steven, why do you think we don't see Rice passage as a normal part of life as 223 00:10:27,501 --> 00:10:29,811 often in the rest, Western and modern? 224 00:10:31,836 --> 00:10:32,766 That's a good question. 225 00:10:32,766 --> 00:10:36,366 I think that we don't have rights of passage today. 226 00:10:36,482 --> 00:10:41,222 I think it was a victim of the Industrial Revolution and you know, don't get me 227 00:10:41,222 --> 00:10:44,582 wrong, there were a lot of good things that came from the Industrial Revolution. 228 00:10:44,642 --> 00:10:48,346 You know, you and I are talking here on a computer one state away from each other. 229 00:10:48,436 --> 00:10:51,464 You know, that's none of that would've been possible without the 230 00:10:51,469 --> 00:10:56,519 Industrial Revolution, but, One downside of it was that it kind of 231 00:10:56,519 --> 00:10:58,409 broke up the nuclear family, right? 232 00:10:58,409 --> 00:11:01,982 So, before the whole family would work together on the farm 233 00:11:01,982 --> 00:11:05,222 or the whole family would work together in the Smith shop, right? 234 00:11:05,252 --> 00:11:07,952 That's why we have people with the last name of Smith because 235 00:11:07,952 --> 00:11:09,752 their whole family were Smiths. 236 00:11:09,752 --> 00:11:12,932 If your dad was a a blacksmith, the son would become a blacksmith. 237 00:11:12,950 --> 00:11:19,387 But with the industrial Revolut, Boys were left, boys were sent off to school, and 238 00:11:19,387 --> 00:11:21,397 dad was sent off to work in a factory. 239 00:11:21,787 --> 00:11:27,097 So there wasn't this as much time spent together as a nuclear family. 240 00:11:27,517 --> 00:11:32,002 And I think that's one reason why we don't see rights of passage today 241 00:11:32,002 --> 00:11:35,842 was because we, we as parents, we sometimes we tend to think, well, 242 00:11:35,842 --> 00:11:37,372 that's the school's job, right? 243 00:11:37,419 --> 00:11:38,736 To, to do that kind of stuff. 244 00:11:40,341 --> 00:11:44,811 . In reality, a school is never gonna give your son a meaningful right of passage 245 00:11:44,811 --> 00:11:48,831 that he can look back on and say, that was the moment that I became a man. 246 00:11:48,831 --> 00:11:49,101 Right? 247 00:11:49,701 --> 00:11:54,801 So I think that's why we as a society don't have these rights of passage. 248 00:11:55,131 --> 00:11:58,911 And when you look at the societies that do have rights of passage, they're 249 00:11:58,911 --> 00:12:02,901 always these communities that, where the family is very strong, right? 250 00:12:02,991 --> 00:12:03,321 Mm-hmm. 251 00:12:03,651 --> 00:12:08,361 , whether it's aboriginal Australian society, or tribes in Africa 252 00:12:08,361 --> 00:12:11,796 or in Brazil, It's these very tight-knit communities that, that 253 00:12:11,796 --> 00:12:13,566 are still practicing this tradition. 254 00:12:15,186 --> 00:12:18,276 I was thinking about it a lot as I read through your book and 255 00:12:18,816 --> 00:12:20,076 you guys did an excellent job. 256 00:12:20,081 --> 00:12:21,066 The book's very good. 257 00:12:22,806 --> 00:12:23,466 I was thinking about it. 258 00:12:23,466 --> 00:12:27,141 Cause I live in a highly Hispanic culture where I live in central Washington. 259 00:12:27,621 --> 00:12:27,771 Yeah. 260 00:12:27,771 --> 00:12:29,991 And so I was, I was really, I started searching my brain. 261 00:12:29,991 --> 00:12:35,841 It's like, what do we, so young women in the Hispanic culture have a quinceanera? 262 00:12:36,021 --> 00:12:36,631 Mm-hmm. 263 00:12:36,637 --> 00:12:37,851 at I believe 15. 264 00:12:38,331 --> 00:12:39,861 And it's becoming of age. 265 00:12:39,921 --> 00:12:42,081 And I, I grew up around the area with that. 266 00:12:42,381 --> 00:12:45,801 And so like the first time I went to one, I mean talk about it, is, 267 00:12:45,801 --> 00:12:47,031 it is second only to a wedding. 268 00:12:47,061 --> 00:12:49,191 I mean, it is a spectacular event. 269 00:12:49,821 --> 00:12:54,261 And at the same time, my brain went, wow, I'm glad that's not my culture 270 00:12:54,266 --> 00:12:56,781 because the price on that is insane. 271 00:12:56,781 --> 00:12:57,801 And I have two daughters. 272 00:12:57,806 --> 00:12:57,861 Yeah. 273 00:12:57,989 --> 00:13:02,549 But I was thinking about it right outside of a Jewish bar, mizvah or Aquita. 274 00:13:02,999 --> 00:13:05,819 I just, you don't see it very often in modern Western. 275 00:13:07,799 --> 00:13:13,679 And so it was like, Hmm, what are we missing by taking these things out? 276 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:15,419 That used to be much more commonplace. 277 00:13:17,009 --> 00:13:21,029 You know, I would say that the closest thing that we have in modern Western 278 00:13:21,029 --> 00:13:27,719 culture to a rite of passage is probably the Sweet 16, and there's a few reason 279 00:13:27,724 --> 00:13:32,009 when we talk about that in the book, but there's a few reasons why a Sweet 16 280 00:13:32,009 --> 00:13:34,769 party is not an actual rite of passage. 281 00:13:35,684 --> 00:13:40,094 For a, for a real rite of passage to occur, there has to be three elements. 282 00:13:40,094 --> 00:13:45,628 There has to be the separation of the boy outside of his normal support system. 283 00:13:45,628 --> 00:13:45,718 Mm-hmm. 284 00:13:46,108 --> 00:13:49,798 . So he has to be removed from his regular day-to-day life. 285 00:13:50,398 --> 00:13:53,218 And then the second thing there has to be a challenge, something 286 00:13:53,218 --> 00:13:57,358 for him to overcome, something for him to prove himself as a man. 287 00:13:57,988 --> 00:14:01,258 And then the third part is the reincorporation back into. 288 00:14:02,863 --> 00:14:07,423 And typically there's, you know, a big celebration, a party involved in it. 289 00:14:07,489 --> 00:14:11,569 And I would argue that a sweet 16, it has the, the after party, 290 00:14:11,569 --> 00:14:14,629 the party element, but it doesn't have those first two elements. 291 00:14:14,629 --> 00:14:19,669 It doesn't have the withdrawing pulling the boy out of his normal life. 292 00:14:20,089 --> 00:14:23,749 It doesn't have a challenge for him to overcome, to prove himself as a man. 293 00:14:24,289 --> 00:14:27,679 So a sweet 16 is not really a rite of passage. 294 00:14:27,739 --> 00:14:29,929 It's definitely not a meaningful rite of passage. 295 00:14:30,289 --> 00:14:34,969 Because it doesn't, it doesn't give a boy an event that says, that, 296 00:14:34,969 --> 00:14:36,829 says, that's when I became a man. 297 00:14:36,889 --> 00:14:40,879 You know what boy would say, oh, my sweet 16 party pool 298 00:14:40,884 --> 00:14:42,709 party was my rite of passage. 299 00:14:42,714 --> 00:14:44,989 That just, it doesn't happen today. 300 00:14:46,009 --> 00:14:48,259 So you pinned this book with your father. 301 00:14:48,619 --> 00:14:50,869 How was that experience of doing this project together, 302 00:14:50,939 --> 00:14:51,429 guys? 303 00:14:52,774 --> 00:14:55,114 So, yeah, my dad and I wrote the book together. 304 00:14:55,203 --> 00:14:56,583 It was really wonderful. 305 00:14:56,673 --> 00:15:00,753 You know, I, I've always had a really strong relationship with my dad. 306 00:15:00,851 --> 00:15:06,671 My dad obviously organized my rite of passage for me when I was 13 years old. 307 00:15:06,773 --> 00:15:09,773 And that was something that helped us to grow together. 308 00:15:09,888 --> 00:15:10,968 Writing the book, I. 309 00:15:11,868 --> 00:15:13,698 Helped us to grow even closer. 310 00:15:14,028 --> 00:15:17,838 One reason why we wanted to do it was because we wanted to have both 311 00:15:17,838 --> 00:15:20,178 the fathers and the sons perspective. 312 00:15:20,658 --> 00:15:25,758 So my dad wrote about why he wanted to hold a rite of passage for all of his 313 00:15:25,758 --> 00:15:27,978 sons and how this tradition got started. 314 00:15:28,548 --> 00:15:33,478 And then I write about what my rite of passage weekend was like as a 13 315 00:15:33,478 --> 00:15:36,588 year old, and some of the thoughts and the feelings going through my. 316 00:15:37,398 --> 00:15:41,178 As my dad and my grandfather and my uncles were kinda sharing this 317 00:15:41,178 --> 00:15:44,928 advice about what it means to be a man, what it means to be a good man. 318 00:15:45,528 --> 00:15:48,779 So, writing the book together was, it was amazing. 319 00:15:49,559 --> 00:15:50,699 Well, let, let's 320 00:15:50,699 --> 00:15:53,639 dive into a little bit of your dad's side here. 321 00:15:54,779 --> 00:15:58,859 Let's talk about the why behind, why this started. 322 00:15:58,859 --> 00:16:02,639 Why, why did your dad fill the need to build this rite of path? 323 00:16:04,424 --> 00:16:09,344 So my dad actually grew up in a household without a father figure. 324 00:16:09,614 --> 00:16:14,486 My dad between the ages of five years old and 17, he only 325 00:16:14,636 --> 00:16:16,646 visited his father three times. 326 00:16:17,126 --> 00:16:23,277 So my paternal grandfather, my dad's dad was diagnosed with multiple 327 00:16:23,282 --> 00:16:25,057 sclerosis when my dad was five years. 328 00:16:26,017 --> 00:16:30,547 And he actually separated from my grandmother and moved down to Mexico 329 00:16:30,637 --> 00:16:33,377 where he could afford 24-hour healthcare. 330 00:16:33,377 --> 00:16:34,731 Cause it's a lot cheaper down there. 331 00:16:34,761 --> 00:16:38,781 Unfortunately, you know, my dad, because of that, my dad really grew 332 00:16:38,781 --> 00:16:40,731 up without having a man in the house. 333 00:16:41,271 --> 00:16:46,371 And so when he grew up, he told himself, you know, I want to give my 334 00:16:46,371 --> 00:16:48,171 kids what I didn't have growing up. 335 00:16:48,176 --> 00:16:53,571 I want to give my kids a lifelong, an example of a lifelong loving marriage. 336 00:16:53,976 --> 00:16:58,956 And I wanna be a father who plays an active role in my son's lives. 337 00:16:59,016 --> 00:17:01,126 I don't wanna be an absent father like my dad. 338 00:17:01,126 --> 00:17:08,444 So fast forward 20 years when my dad had, you know, the four of us boys 339 00:17:08,449 --> 00:17:13,574 I have, I come from a family of four boys and my older brother was turning 340 00:17:13,984 --> 00:17:18,704 13 years old, and my dad wanted to do something special for his birthday 341 00:17:18,709 --> 00:17:20,114 to mark his entrance into man. 342 00:17:20,894 --> 00:17:24,584 You know, my dad knew that the teenage years were not gonna be easy, and that 343 00:17:24,764 --> 00:17:27,134 teenage boys especially do crazy things. 344 00:17:27,554 --> 00:17:33,194 But he thought, you know, if we can, if we can connect with the boy, if 345 00:17:33,194 --> 00:17:37,844 we can affirm his masculine identity and show how much he's loved in this 346 00:17:37,844 --> 00:17:41,984 family, then maybe he won't feel the need to try to prove himself and do 347 00:17:41,984 --> 00:17:44,204 these crazy stunts as a teenager. 348 00:17:44,744 --> 00:17:50,024 So my dad actually went to his father-in-law, my maternal grandfather. 349 00:17:51,209 --> 00:17:54,569 and he said, you know, I want to do something special for my 350 00:17:54,569 --> 00:17:57,119 son's 13th birthday, but I'm not really sure what to do. 351 00:17:57,599 --> 00:18:00,959 And it was my maternal grandfather who said, well, you know, in these 352 00:18:00,959 --> 00:18:04,469 other cultures they have these rights of passage tra traditions. 353 00:18:04,859 --> 00:18:07,829 What if we came up with a Christian version of one of those? 354 00:18:08,159 --> 00:18:10,979 So that's really where they started to brainstorm. 355 00:18:11,009 --> 00:18:12,329 Well, what would that look like? 356 00:18:12,329 --> 00:18:15,869 What would a meaningful rite of passage look like for a Christian 357 00:18:15,869 --> 00:18:18,299 boy growing up in the early 2000? 358 00:18:18,824 --> 00:18:20,474 And that's kind of how the weekend got started. 359 00:18:21,074 --> 00:18:21,494 Okay. 360 00:18:22,034 --> 00:18:25,604 Now you went through this process at 13. 361 00:18:26,414 --> 00:18:31,124 How did your own rite of impact or rite of passage really impact you for the better? 362 00:18:31,184 --> 00:18:35,294 Like in hindsight, looking back today, what difference do you 363 00:18:35,294 --> 00:18:36,164 think that made for you? 364 00:18:37,214 --> 00:18:40,484 Yeah, so I had a rite of passage when I was 13 years old. 365 00:18:40,498 --> 00:18:45,538 It was a weekend trip that involved my dad, my grandfather, and two of my uncle. 366 00:18:46,453 --> 00:18:52,003 And I think the way that my rite of passage benefited me was really twofold. 367 00:18:52,423 --> 00:18:57,223 For one, I was growing up, I was really confident in my masculine identity. 368 00:18:57,883 --> 00:19:01,183 And I don't mean to say that, you know, as a teenager I had like 369 00:19:01,213 --> 00:19:05,443 huge biceps or a puffed up chest, like I was a man at 13 years old. 370 00:19:05,773 --> 00:19:10,243 But, but I do mean to say is that anytime someone outside of the family, 371 00:19:10,303 --> 00:19:13,453 whether it was a teacher or another parent, you know, at Boy Scout. 372 00:19:14,023 --> 00:19:18,373 Anytime they kind of referred to me as a boy, like if the teacher of the class 373 00:19:18,373 --> 00:19:20,053 would say, boys, boys, settle down. 374 00:19:20,773 --> 00:19:25,093 Then immediately the first thought in my mind was, I'm not a boy. 375 00:19:25,213 --> 00:19:27,133 I'm a man because my dad told me. 376 00:19:27,433 --> 00:19:27,823 Right? 377 00:19:28,213 --> 00:19:31,153 So I never questioned my status as a man. 378 00:19:31,183 --> 00:19:34,453 I never thought, you know, when is, when am I gonna become a man? 379 00:19:34,453 --> 00:19:35,563 When is this gonna kick in? 380 00:19:36,223 --> 00:19:41,563 And I didn't realize what a gift that was until probably my early twenties when I. 381 00:19:42,583 --> 00:19:47,323 A friend who was engaged and getting married, and I write about it in the 382 00:19:47,323 --> 00:19:52,038 book, how we had this interaction where we were actually doing some chores. 383 00:19:52,068 --> 00:19:56,448 We were doing some handy work around his house, some construction projects, and 384 00:19:56,508 --> 00:20:01,068 he kind of stopped me halfway through and he was like, Steve, when was the first 385 00:20:01,068 --> 00:20:03,258 time you considered yourself to be a man? 386 00:20:04,518 --> 00:20:09,078 I, I told him about this Rite of Passage weekend as a 13 year old, and 387 00:20:09,078 --> 00:20:10,908 he was like, wow, that's incredible. 388 00:20:10,908 --> 00:20:11,238 You know? 389 00:20:11,238 --> 00:20:16,322 And here he is engaged to a engaged to an awesome woman, you know, potentially 390 00:20:16,322 --> 00:20:17,942 having kids in the near future. 391 00:20:18,362 --> 00:20:19,262 He has a job. 392 00:20:19,262 --> 00:20:23,132 He has an awesome relationship with his parents, you know, and he's still 393 00:20:23,582 --> 00:20:25,232 questioning his identity as a man. 394 00:20:25,232 --> 00:20:27,782 He's not sure if he's a man or he's a boy. 395 00:20:28,352 --> 00:20:32,382 And it was that conversation with my friend in my early twenties when I. 396 00:20:33,212 --> 00:20:33,632 Wow. 397 00:20:33,692 --> 00:20:38,312 This rite of passage was a real gift for me to, to have this clear 398 00:20:38,312 --> 00:20:41,732 event in my, in my mind, that I can look back on and say, you know, 399 00:20:41,732 --> 00:20:43,472 that's when manhood began for me. 400 00:20:43,472 --> 00:20:45,962 It wasn't, wasn't prom night for me. 401 00:20:45,962 --> 00:20:49,593 It wasn't the the day where my wife and I got married. 402 00:20:50,103 --> 00:20:52,053 It wasn't the, the birth of our daughter. 403 00:20:52,083 --> 00:20:55,623 For me, it was 13 years old when my dad and my grandfather told 404 00:20:55,623 --> 00:20:57,543 me that you are a man in this. 405 00:20:58,473 --> 00:21:01,383 So I think the first way that it benefited me was I was always 406 00:21:01,383 --> 00:21:03,933 confident in my masculine identity. 407 00:21:03,986 --> 00:21:08,816 The second way that it benefited me was that I, growing up, I really 408 00:21:08,821 --> 00:21:13,826 felt like I could talk to my dad, my grandfather, and my uncles about anything. 409 00:21:13,886 --> 00:21:19,736 I felt very accepted and loved by this kind of tribe of men in my family. 410 00:21:20,966 --> 00:21:24,656 You know, one thing that kind of gets said during the weekend inevitably 411 00:21:24,656 --> 00:21:31,091 is, From the men, the boy, they say, you know, we love you unconditionally. 412 00:21:31,241 --> 00:21:36,041 If you ever have questions or are going through kind of a tough spot 413 00:21:36,041 --> 00:21:41,171 in life, please come to us for advice because we love you unconditionally. 414 00:21:41,201 --> 00:21:45,371 We have your best interests at heart, and more than likely we've gone 415 00:21:45,371 --> 00:21:46,901 through whatever you're going through. 416 00:21:46,906 --> 00:21:47,621 We can help you. 417 00:21:48,401 --> 00:21:52,991 You know, as a 13 year old, during my Rite of Passage weekend, I was like, I just 418 00:21:52,996 --> 00:21:54,221 kind of shook my head up and down and. 419 00:21:55,001 --> 00:21:55,451 Thanks. 420 00:21:55,451 --> 00:22:00,131 You know, I, I didn't know what to make of it, but it really wasn't until I got into 421 00:22:00,131 --> 00:22:04,991 college where, you know, I started meeting people who were raised very different than 422 00:22:04,991 --> 00:22:07,061 me, who had very different values than me. 423 00:22:07,541 --> 00:22:11,651 And that made me really question the way that I was raised and my own beliefs. 424 00:22:12,431 --> 00:22:16,863 And in college I was really concerned, you know, I was really I started to 425 00:22:17,343 --> 00:22:20,763 question my belief in God, whether I believed in God or I wanted to. 426 00:22:21,918 --> 00:22:23,838 The faith that my parents raised me in. 427 00:22:24,528 --> 00:22:29,508 And I remember being very nervous to talk to my parents about, about it 428 00:22:29,508 --> 00:22:33,318 because I wasn't sure how they would've react if I told 'em, you know, I'm 429 00:22:33,318 --> 00:22:34,998 not sure if I believe in God anymore. 430 00:22:35,448 --> 00:22:36,978 I didn't wanna disappoint them, right? 431 00:22:37,128 --> 00:22:37,218 Mm-hmm. 432 00:22:37,548 --> 00:22:42,858 . But in college, I remembered back that 13 year old rite of passage 433 00:22:42,858 --> 00:22:44,538 this weekend and how all the men. 434 00:22:45,348 --> 00:22:47,838 If you have questions, if you're going through a tough time in 435 00:22:47,838 --> 00:22:49,908 life, please come to us for advice. 436 00:22:49,908 --> 00:22:50,838 We won't judge you. 437 00:22:51,168 --> 00:22:52,638 We will love you unconditionally. 438 00:22:52,638 --> 00:22:54,258 We have your best interest at heart. 439 00:22:54,768 --> 00:22:58,938 And that gave me the confidence, the trust, to go back to these guys, 440 00:22:59,508 --> 00:23:03,298 to go back to my dad, to go to my grandfather and say, dad, grandpa, 441 00:23:04,188 --> 00:23:05,808 I'm not sure if I believe in God. 442 00:23:06,018 --> 00:23:07,218 Why do you believe in God? 443 00:23:07,308 --> 00:23:07,728 You know? 444 00:23:07,728 --> 00:23:12,198 And I think it was at that moment, for a lot of people, college is really kind 445 00:23:12,198 --> 00:23:14,118 of a make or break moment in your faith. 446 00:23:15,153 --> 00:23:19,623 And it certainly was for me and I, you know, hindsight is 2020. 447 00:23:19,623 --> 00:23:23,976 But I would say if it wasn't for this rite of passage weekend, there's a 448 00:23:23,976 --> 00:23:27,486 good chance that I would not be a practicing Christian today without it. 449 00:23:28,386 --> 00:23:28,596 Okay. 450 00:23:30,156 --> 00:23:32,676 I love that it open up the lines of communication in your family. 451 00:23:32,706 --> 00:23:38,946 That is a very difficult thing for young men to feel comfortable communicating with 452 00:23:38,946 --> 00:23:42,576 those in their family and, and drawing that line in this hand cuz it really. 453 00:23:43,476 --> 00:23:44,856 Your book had me thinking a lot. 454 00:23:45,876 --> 00:23:49,236 . The wheels were just turning in my head like a hamster going nuts, man. 455 00:23:49,716 --> 00:23:52,176 As I was reading through the book and it was like, wow, we have 456 00:23:52,176 --> 00:23:56,406 really just kind of failed our young men because it is right there. 457 00:23:56,411 --> 00:24:00,336 There's all these different benchmarks of, well, 18, you 458 00:24:00,336 --> 00:24:02,196 can smoke and join the military. 459 00:24:02,541 --> 00:24:05,211 At 17, you can join the military with your parents' re mission. 460 00:24:05,391 --> 00:24:09,141 But at 21 you can drink and do this, but at 25 you can do this. 461 00:24:09,141 --> 00:24:09,411 Right? 462 00:24:09,651 --> 00:24:12,351 We, we have all these different bench like, but none of that 463 00:24:12,941 --> 00:24:14,691 actually tells them or affirms. 464 00:24:15,261 --> 00:24:18,291 You are now a valuable member of society. 465 00:24:18,291 --> 00:24:19,581 You are now a man. 466 00:24:20,211 --> 00:24:23,901 It's time for you to stand on your own feet because you, you need 467 00:24:23,901 --> 00:24:25,221 that line in the sand too, right? 468 00:24:25,221 --> 00:24:31,221 We have too many 27 year olds still living at home, sucking off a mom and dad. 469 00:24:31,656 --> 00:24:34,926 Because they were never told, Hey, you're a man. 470 00:24:35,076 --> 00:24:37,836 It, it is time to take that next step on your own. 471 00:24:38,766 --> 00:24:40,956 So y y'all's book got me thinking a lot. 472 00:24:41,856 --> 00:24:42,396 Let's talk, 473 00:24:42,401 --> 00:24:43,446 well, go ahead. 474 00:24:43,896 --> 00:24:45,486 No, thank, I was just gonna say thank you. 475 00:24:45,486 --> 00:24:50,256 You know, it's true that I think today we're, in general, we're not raising 476 00:24:50,261 --> 00:24:53,316 boys to be like virtuously masculine men. 477 00:24:53,526 --> 00:24:57,816 And a big reason is that most men today have never been. 478 00:24:58,611 --> 00:25:03,021 By another man that you are a man and that manhood has begun. 479 00:25:03,111 --> 00:25:06,651 You know, manhood has probably begun a long time ago for most of 480 00:25:06,651 --> 00:25:10,341 these guys, and because they've never been told that they're a man, 481 00:25:10,346 --> 00:25:14,211 then they essentially act like boys into their twenties and into their 482 00:25:14,216 --> 00:25:16,191 thirties like you were talking about. 483 00:25:16,461 --> 00:25:21,651 So that's kind of the, the beauty of a rite of passage is that it gives the boy a 484 00:25:21,651 --> 00:25:23,631 clear moment that he can look back on and. 485 00:25:24,426 --> 00:25:25,416 That was the moment. 486 00:25:25,416 --> 00:25:28,506 That was the weekend that I became a man because that's when 487 00:25:28,506 --> 00:25:30,126 my dad told me that I was a man. 488 00:25:31,176 --> 00:25:33,096 So let's talk milestone to manhood. 489 00:25:33,576 --> 00:25:35,286 This become a full family event. 490 00:25:35,286 --> 00:25:39,366 I know according to your book, the women and family help you guys prepare and 491 00:25:39,366 --> 00:25:43,176 get things in order and then help you celebrate also when you get home, right? 492 00:25:43,176 --> 00:25:46,896 They take part in recognizing that this young man has become a. 493 00:25:48,111 --> 00:25:51,561 And you know, that's, that's an important part is the young man gets that 494 00:25:51,561 --> 00:25:56,451 affirmation as well when he gets home that this weekend has changed his status. 495 00:25:57,021 --> 00:25:57,111 Mm-hmm. 496 00:25:57,381 --> 00:26:00,471 , how many times, you said you're one of four brothers, how many 497 00:26:00,471 --> 00:26:01,641 times have y'all done this now? 498 00:26:03,141 --> 00:26:04,461 So, right. 499 00:26:04,461 --> 00:26:05,761 I'm one of four brothers. 500 00:26:05,792 --> 00:26:09,692 So me and my brothers, we all got these rite of passage weekends, and 501 00:26:09,692 --> 00:26:11,792 then my male cousins did as well. 502 00:26:11,822 --> 00:26:13,869 So, I have two younger male cousins. 503 00:26:13,869 --> 00:26:14,319 So for. 504 00:26:15,054 --> 00:26:19,794 I had a write-off passage weekend that was organized for me, but also once I 505 00:26:19,794 --> 00:26:25,134 became, you know, an official man in the family, I was eligible to be one of those 506 00:26:25,134 --> 00:26:28,704 male mentors to go along the weekends. 507 00:26:28,745 --> 00:26:33,772 So I had a write-up passage for myself that I experienced as a 13 year old, but 508 00:26:33,772 --> 00:26:37,942 I also attended four other Rite of passage weekends for my two younger brother. 509 00:26:38,647 --> 00:26:42,757 My two younger cousins and I will say, I'll add in that the woman 510 00:26:42,757 --> 00:26:46,177 of the family, the girls did get a rite of passage weekend as well. 511 00:26:46,177 --> 00:26:50,322 So, I don't have any sisters, but my girl cousins did get a rite of passage. 512 00:26:50,322 --> 00:26:56,107 So in total there were 12 of these rite of passage weekends that we held as a family. 513 00:26:56,677 --> 00:26:56,917 Yeah. 514 00:26:56,917 --> 00:26:57,157 Y'all 515 00:26:57,157 --> 00:27:00,157 mentioned in the book that there might be a second book coming from 516 00:27:00,157 --> 00:27:01,597 the women's side of the family. 517 00:27:01,688 --> 00:27:04,658 I'm looking forward to that book as well, cuz I have two daughters, so 518 00:27:04,958 --> 00:27:09,134 I'm, I'm looking forward to that second edition where the women in the family get 519 00:27:09,134 --> 00:27:11,704 focused on it and share that information. 520 00:27:11,709 --> 00:27:13,354 Cuz I, I know Yeah. 521 00:27:13,354 --> 00:27:15,274 My wife is in the background saying, yes, please. 522 00:27:15,574 --> 00:27:16,624 We, we want that book. 523 00:27:16,624 --> 00:27:20,494 So you have at least a couple people going, yes, please, please do the 524 00:27:20,494 --> 00:27:24,760 follow up on, you know, women because I, I think we're lacking in this. 525 00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:26,290 I think there's a lot of validity to. 526 00:27:27,940 --> 00:27:33,760 Now, what have you noticed just in the lives of young men, outside of your 527 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:38,290 family, maybe like family, friends and stuff, as opposed to you, the 528 00:27:38,290 --> 00:27:40,030 way you guys were raised with this. 529 00:27:40,330 --> 00:27:43,090 What, what are the immediate differences that you guys can see? 530 00:27:43,090 --> 00:27:45,895 Just contrasting, you said your family is different. 531 00:27:45,895 --> 00:27:47,575 That's something that you learned in college. 532 00:27:47,845 --> 00:27:49,217 I had that same experience. 533 00:27:49,254 --> 00:27:51,264 There was a point in my life where I started looking around at 534 00:27:51,264 --> 00:27:52,504 my friends' families and going. 535 00:27:53,004 --> 00:27:55,614 My former family isn't normal, the, the way we mm-hmm. 536 00:27:55,694 --> 00:27:57,234 because we're all very, very tight-knit. 537 00:27:57,234 --> 00:28:00,894 My siblings are some of the closest people in the world to me, always have been. 538 00:28:01,014 --> 00:28:01,434 Right. 539 00:28:01,674 --> 00:28:04,494 And I thought that was normal until I started hanging out with other people. 540 00:28:04,974 --> 00:28:09,294 But as you experienced this and you know, you guys have friends outside 541 00:28:09,294 --> 00:28:12,924 of the immediate family whose kids weren't put through this process. 542 00:28:13,824 --> 00:28:16,434 What do you, what do you notice the immediate differences 543 00:28:16,734 --> 00:28:17,664 in those young people? 544 00:28:18,294 --> 00:28:22,224 You know, to be honest, it's tough to say because I consider this 545 00:28:22,224 --> 00:28:25,404 rite of passage weekend to be a tool in the tool belt, right? 546 00:28:25,434 --> 00:28:25,754 Mm-hmm. 547 00:28:25,974 --> 00:28:28,014 , the rite of passage weekend is not everything. 548 00:28:28,224 --> 00:28:32,184 I mean, as a father, you have to be a good example of what it means to be a 549 00:28:32,184 --> 00:28:34,764 man your, for your entire life, right? 550 00:28:34,769 --> 00:28:34,954 Mm. 551 00:28:34,954 --> 00:28:35,234 Mm-hmm. 552 00:28:35,314 --> 00:28:40,554 , if you're objectively a bad example of a man, And then you hold one of these rite 553 00:28:40,554 --> 00:28:44,424 of passage weekends and are talking about virtuous manhood and what it means to 554 00:28:44,424 --> 00:28:47,094 be a man, then it really means nothing. 555 00:28:47,094 --> 00:28:47,454 Right? 556 00:28:47,454 --> 00:28:54,666 So, I considered this weekend to be just one way that a father can help 557 00:28:54,666 --> 00:28:58,206 to break through to his son, you know, and to affirm him and to build him up. 558 00:28:58,303 --> 00:29:03,343 So I think that it, it's tough to compare because of that, because 559 00:29:03,343 --> 00:29:05,031 it is just one weekend right. 560 00:29:05,061 --> 00:29:11,751 But I will say, You know, in the absence of a rite of passage, boys feel the need 561 00:29:11,811 --> 00:29:13,941 to prove their manhood to themselves. 562 00:29:14,421 --> 00:29:18,831 And what that might look like, I would say, is the sexual conquest of women. 563 00:29:18,921 --> 00:29:22,341 So you hear guys saying things like, she made a man out of me. 564 00:29:22,431 --> 00:29:22,821 Right? 565 00:29:23,691 --> 00:29:28,851 You guys trying to sleep around and sexually conquesting conquering women 566 00:29:29,061 --> 00:29:30,981 to prove their manhood to themselves. 567 00:29:31,671 --> 00:29:33,621 Or it could be violence, right? 568 00:29:33,621 --> 00:29:35,301 Joining a gang or getting into a. 569 00:29:36,906 --> 00:29:39,336 When boys are fighting, essentially they're trying to 570 00:29:39,336 --> 00:29:40,926 prove their manhood to themselves. 571 00:29:40,926 --> 00:29:44,916 They're, they're saying, if I can show physically dominate another 572 00:29:44,916 --> 00:29:47,316 man, then I'm a better man than him. 573 00:29:47,316 --> 00:29:47,646 Right? 574 00:29:48,306 --> 00:29:52,776 So in that way, violence, they're trying to prove their manhood to themselves. 575 00:29:53,226 --> 00:29:56,840 Or another, you know, really common one would be video game addictions. 576 00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:01,700 In a lot of video games, you can literally go out and slay a dragon 577 00:30:01,700 --> 00:30:03,620 or kill a, kill a terrorist. 578 00:30:03,620 --> 00:30:07,940 You know, that totally plays into the male ego of proving yourself as 579 00:30:07,940 --> 00:30:09,860 a warrior, proving yourself as a man. 580 00:30:10,370 --> 00:30:13,638 And you know, I have nothing against video games but I am 581 00:30:13,643 --> 00:30:15,318 against video game addictions. 582 00:30:15,708 --> 00:30:19,458 When, when you play video games to the point where you're getting your 583 00:30:19,958 --> 00:30:23,838 masculine identity, your identity is tied up to your video game character, 584 00:30:24,198 --> 00:30:25,758 then I think something has gone wrong. 585 00:30:26,823 --> 00:30:30,153 In the absence of a rite of passage, boys will try to prove 586 00:30:30,153 --> 00:30:31,623 their manhood to themselves. 587 00:30:32,013 --> 00:30:36,303 And I think that was the difference for me having this weekend, is 588 00:30:36,303 --> 00:30:41,043 that I had this weekend where my dad, my grandfather, my uncles told 589 00:30:41,043 --> 00:30:42,873 me, you are a man of this family. 590 00:30:43,233 --> 00:30:47,763 So as a teenager, I didn't feel like I had to prove my manhood to anybody else. 591 00:30:48,903 --> 00:30:52,503 So I think that's probably the biggest difference between what our family 592 00:30:52,503 --> 00:30:57,453 did and other families who don't have this rite of passage for their kids. 593 00:30:57,963 --> 00:30:58,263 Okay. 594 00:30:58,323 --> 00:31:01,173 I was asking just because you threw out the example of your 595 00:31:01,173 --> 00:31:03,513 friend at his wedding, right. 596 00:31:03,573 --> 00:31:08,583 Having to ask that question that in his head, apparently that was still a question 597 00:31:08,583 --> 00:31:10,123 in something he was still playing with. 598 00:31:10,157 --> 00:31:13,607 So I was wondering if you had noticed any other areas where it was 599 00:31:13,607 --> 00:31:16,487 like, oh, this really divided this. 600 00:31:17,402 --> 00:31:17,792 Yeah. 601 00:31:18,332 --> 00:31:21,242 Now guys, we're gonna roll to one of our sponsors and we will be right 602 00:31:21,242 --> 00:31:22,772 back with more from Steven Arms. 603 00:31:23,432 --> 00:31:24,662 How well do you sleep at night? 604 00:31:24,812 --> 00:31:27,362 Do you toss and turn and wake up more tired than when you went to bed? 605 00:31:27,902 --> 00:31:30,542 Sleep is commonly one of the critical elements people 606 00:31:30,547 --> 00:31:31,862 fall short on in their life. 607 00:31:32,162 --> 00:31:35,042 The quality of sleep you get directly affects your ability to control 608 00:31:35,042 --> 00:31:38,432 your weight, your ability to add muscle, your stress levels, and your 609 00:31:38,902 --> 00:31:40,142 everyday job and life performance. 610 00:31:40,742 --> 00:31:42,812 If you're ready to move to the next level, then. 611 00:31:43,592 --> 00:31:44,672 Has to be part of the plan. 612 00:31:45,302 --> 00:31:48,482 Check out our forensic ghost bed.com if you're ready to get your best sleep. 613 00:31:48,572 --> 00:31:49,472 I love my ghost bed. 614 00:31:49,472 --> 00:31:52,172 I've been sleeping on one for a couple years and has made a 615 00:31:52,172 --> 00:31:53,792 huge difference in how I sleep. 616 00:31:54,152 --> 00:31:58,172 Hit ghost bed.com and use the code, the Fallible Man 30 to get 30% off your 617 00:31:58,172 --> 00:31:59,972 order and start getting better night's. 618 00:31:59,972 --> 00:32:01,202 Sleep tomorrow. 619 00:32:02,192 --> 00:32:04,142 Now let's go on to the show. 620 00:32:04,502 --> 00:32:05,162 Hey, welcome back. 621 00:32:05,162 --> 00:32:09,062 We're here with Stephen Arms Discussing is a Christian Rite Passage a good idea for. 622 00:32:10,142 --> 00:32:13,322 Now, if you've missed the first part of the conversation, you absolutely have 623 00:32:13,322 --> 00:32:16,682 to go back through because we've covered a lot of ground and a lot of details. 624 00:32:17,552 --> 00:32:21,512 Steven and his family have had this personal experience that they're sharing 625 00:32:21,517 --> 00:32:27,662 with the world now, guys, the book is Milestone to Manhood and we'll have 626 00:32:27,662 --> 00:32:32,132 links of course to get that book into the website, so you can check that out. 627 00:32:32,312 --> 00:32:33,872 We want you to be able to find this book. 628 00:32:34,352 --> 00:32:34,892 Personally. 629 00:32:35,282 --> 00:32:36,092 I love the book. 630 00:32:36,097 --> 00:32:37,142 It was a great read. 631 00:32:38,477 --> 00:32:40,097 Man, it just got my head spinning. 632 00:32:40,547 --> 00:32:44,147 But I don't wanna go into too much detail about the book because I'd 633 00:32:44,147 --> 00:32:47,387 love for you to read it because until you actually go through it, 634 00:32:47,387 --> 00:32:49,157 like I'm not gonna do it justice. 635 00:32:49,457 --> 00:32:52,787 But I wanted to touch a couple on a couple things in the book 636 00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:53,850 especially towards the end. 637 00:32:54,120 --> 00:33:01,470 So Steven, how is life with your newly Christian man Posten? 638 00:33:01,475 --> 00:33:02,730 How does that change? 639 00:33:02,730 --> 00:33:04,254 It was an interesting transit. 640 00:33:04,989 --> 00:33:07,599 In the book, because life has to change, right? 641 00:33:07,599 --> 00:33:12,699 You can't say you're a man and then go back home and, and life is the same. 642 00:33:13,029 --> 00:33:14,049 So how does that look? 643 00:33:15,819 --> 00:33:16,329 Absolutely. 644 00:33:16,334 --> 00:33:20,109 So there kind of has to be a balanced approach for life after the weekend, 645 00:33:20,169 --> 00:33:24,519 you know, ultimately this new man is still a 13 year old, you know? 646 00:33:24,524 --> 00:33:28,809 So obviously it would not be appropriate to kick him out of the house, tell him 647 00:33:28,809 --> 00:33:30,399 to go get an apartment and a full-time. 648 00:33:30,471 --> 00:33:33,591 It has to be a gradual approach, how you treat him as a man. 649 00:33:34,041 --> 00:33:37,101 But it is important to treat him differently after his 650 00:33:37,101 --> 00:33:38,271 rite of passage weekend. 651 00:33:38,350 --> 00:33:41,830 You know, certainly increasing responsibilities around the 652 00:33:41,830 --> 00:33:43,330 house is a good way to do that. 653 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:47,680 I know for me and for my brothers 13 years old was right around the 654 00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:51,160 time where we were physically big enough to push the lawnmower around. 655 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:53,108 So, that became one of our chore. 656 00:33:53,978 --> 00:33:58,838 And you know, inevitably whenever you increase the responsibilities, the 657 00:33:58,838 --> 00:34:02,648 chores for your kids, there's always gonna be some resistance, right? 658 00:34:02,648 --> 00:34:03,578 They're not gonna like it. 659 00:34:03,638 --> 00:34:08,948 But having this rite of passage weekend gives fathers context to have 660 00:34:08,948 --> 00:34:10,748 those discussions with their sons. 661 00:34:11,108 --> 00:34:13,828 Why increasing their responsibility is a good thing. 662 00:34:14,288 --> 00:34:18,008 So dads don't have to say something like, you need to mow 663 00:34:18,008 --> 00:34:19,688 the lawn now, because I say so. 664 00:34:20,318 --> 00:34:23,828 That's just kind of a, a flex on your authority over him. 665 00:34:24,188 --> 00:34:29,048 But if you say something like, we want you to mow the lawn now, because when 666 00:34:29,048 --> 00:34:33,008 you grow up, when you get married and have a family of your own, you're gonna 667 00:34:33,008 --> 00:34:36,248 have to mow the lawn because we're not, I'm not gonna be there for you. 668 00:34:36,278 --> 00:34:39,458 So it's really a good thing for you to learn how to do this now 669 00:34:39,498 --> 00:34:42,998 rather than learning in your twenties or in your thirties. 670 00:34:43,104 --> 00:34:47,094 Another really cool way that the boy was treated differently. 671 00:34:47,484 --> 00:34:52,284 After his Rite of Passage weekend, you know, in our family, whenever we gathered 672 00:34:52,284 --> 00:34:57,114 together for holidays, whether it was Christmas or Easter, you know, it was 673 00:34:57,114 --> 00:34:59,184 always a, a fairly large gathering. 674 00:34:59,316 --> 00:35:01,296 And so there were always two tables. 675 00:35:01,296 --> 00:35:04,596 You know, there was an adult table in one room and then a kid's table and 676 00:35:04,601 --> 00:35:09,726 another, and, but once a boy or the, or a girl went through one of these rite of 677 00:35:09,726 --> 00:35:14,286 passage weekends, they were, they kind of graduated from the kids' table into 678 00:35:14,286 --> 00:35:15,786 the adults' table, you know, and they. 679 00:35:16,581 --> 00:35:19,491 Instead of having the conversation with the kids, they were engaged in 680 00:35:19,491 --> 00:35:23,406 conversation with the adults and whatever they were talking about over dinner. 681 00:35:23,411 --> 00:35:27,786 So that was one really cool, kind of physical way to show, you know, you 682 00:35:27,786 --> 00:35:32,946 were no longer a boy or a girl, you've graduated to manhood or to womanhood. 683 00:35:33,866 --> 00:35:36,816 Now you guys have put together this, cuz I'm gonna call the 684 00:35:36,821 --> 00:35:38,586 book more of a blueprint, right? 685 00:35:38,586 --> 00:35:42,216 You answered the why's, but then you laid out a very tructure. 686 00:35:42,986 --> 00:35:45,276 Approach that y'all have found has been very effective for you? 687 00:35:46,386 --> 00:35:50,406 How does that translate to another father picking up this book? 688 00:35:51,036 --> 00:35:52,656 How is the best way to apply 689 00:35:52,656 --> 00:35:53,106 this book? 690 00:35:54,426 --> 00:35:58,656 Yeah, so we realized, you know, our family, having organized 12 of these 691 00:35:58,716 --> 00:36:03,186 rite of passage weekends before, we've really accumulated a lot of best 692 00:36:03,646 --> 00:36:06,876 practices, a lot of tribal knowledge, how to pull one of these weekends. 693 00:36:07,656 --> 00:36:13,566 So the book is really a how to guide for fathers who want to organize a rite 694 00:36:13,566 --> 00:36:15,778 of passage weekend for their own sons. 695 00:36:15,778 --> 00:36:18,443 And in that way it's very much plug, plug and play, right? 696 00:36:18,473 --> 00:36:23,393 We give you the exact steps, step by steps, the rituals that we went through 697 00:36:23,393 --> 00:36:25,103 in our rite of passage weekends. 698 00:36:25,673 --> 00:36:29,153 And, you know, certainly we would love it if, if a father wanted to 699 00:36:29,153 --> 00:36:33,203 just adopt it straight outta the book and use all seven of the same ritual. 700 00:36:33,953 --> 00:36:38,453 We also give guidance on how you might wanna modify it for your own family. 701 00:36:38,513 --> 00:36:41,922 You know, if you have family traditions in your own family that you wanna 702 00:36:41,922 --> 00:36:46,632 add into the weekend, we absolutely would encourage you to add it into 703 00:36:46,632 --> 00:36:48,282 the weekend and to make it your own. 704 00:36:48,387 --> 00:36:53,067 One thing I'd like to add for your audience is that on our website, 705 00:36:53,657 --> 00:36:57,447 milestone to manhood.com, we've actually put up some email template. 706 00:36:57,927 --> 00:36:59,427 For fathers to access. 707 00:36:59,517 --> 00:37:03,927 So if you're listening to this and you have an 11 or 12 year old son and you 708 00:37:03,927 --> 00:37:09,177 want to organize a rite of passage for him, you can just go to our website. 709 00:37:09,207 --> 00:37:12,957 There's a planning section, and you can, there's five steps. 710 00:37:12,957 --> 00:37:17,817 You can literally go to it, copy the text from the website and paste 711 00:37:17,817 --> 00:37:22,437 it into the body of an email for the men who you want to invite 712 00:37:22,437 --> 00:37:24,177 to go onto your right of passage. 713 00:37:25,077 --> 00:37:29,967 With you and your son and this weekend, this email explains what a rite of 714 00:37:29,967 --> 00:37:35,007 passage is, why you want to hold one for your son, and exactly the step by 715 00:37:35,007 --> 00:37:40,497 steps of the Rite of Passage weekend that our family did for the boys and girls. 716 00:37:41,142 --> 00:37:45,552 So, you know, we realized, you know, we have all this information, why 717 00:37:45,552 --> 00:37:50,022 not give it to listeners for free so that they can organize a rite 718 00:37:50,022 --> 00:37:52,002 of passage as easy as possible. 719 00:37:52,362 --> 00:37:56,112 One of the hardest parts is just explaining to people what a rite of 720 00:37:56,112 --> 00:37:57,852 passage is and why you want to do it. 721 00:37:58,212 --> 00:38:02,442 So we realized, why don't we just give that to our listeners for. 722 00:38:03,522 --> 00:38:06,582 We don't ask for your email address because we know, you know, a lot of 723 00:38:06,582 --> 00:38:09,132 guys don't wanna be spammed these days. 724 00:38:09,192 --> 00:38:10,062 I totally get it. 725 00:38:10,122 --> 00:38:11,185 I don't want to either. 726 00:38:11,185 --> 00:38:15,219 So you literally just go to the website, copy these emails, and paste them into 727 00:38:15,249 --> 00:38:17,619 the body of an email to send to your team. 728 00:38:18,699 --> 00:38:19,089 Okay. 729 00:38:19,149 --> 00:38:19,809 That's awesome. 730 00:38:20,139 --> 00:38:24,519 I love that you guys leave room for customization, right? 731 00:38:24,699 --> 00:38:29,949 You had some really great ideas, but the fact that you leave room in there say, 732 00:38:29,949 --> 00:38:31,509 Hey, this is what's been good for us. 733 00:38:31,929 --> 00:38:35,769 But, you know, tweak this for your experience as a family. 734 00:38:35,789 --> 00:38:37,175 It's, it is just incredible. 735 00:38:37,745 --> 00:38:40,565 Now, Steven, there are some guys out there right now who are 736 00:38:40,565 --> 00:38:43,495 listening who are like, uh hmm. 737 00:38:43,505 --> 00:38:44,945 Is this right for me? 738 00:38:45,905 --> 00:38:49,025 What are three questions our listeners should ask themselves to 739 00:38:49,030 --> 00:38:51,125 decide if this is something they should implement with their sons? 740 00:38:52,970 --> 00:38:56,360 You know, I would say if you're on the fence, if you're a father on the 741 00:38:56,360 --> 00:39:00,470 fence, thinking about whether you want to organize one of these weekends for 742 00:39:00,470 --> 00:39:04,656 your son or not, ultimately, you know, it's you're not doing this for yourself. 743 00:39:04,656 --> 00:39:05,946 You're doing this for your son. 744 00:39:06,066 --> 00:39:06,426 Right? 745 00:39:06,846 --> 00:39:11,616 And the truth is, is that not all the responsibility is going to fall on your 746 00:39:11,616 --> 00:39:16,536 shoulders because you are gonna get other men involved to help to break through to. 747 00:39:16,554 --> 00:39:20,676 You know, certainly dads are the most important male role model in 748 00:39:20,676 --> 00:39:24,876 a boy's life, but around the age of 13, there's also this tension that 749 00:39:24,876 --> 00:39:26,796 develops between father and son, right? 750 00:39:27,176 --> 00:39:30,486 The, the boy doesn't necessarily want to listen to dad all the time. 751 00:39:30,876 --> 00:39:34,171 So that's really the beauty of getting other men involved other 752 00:39:34,321 --> 00:39:35,521 men who are not his father. 753 00:39:35,521 --> 00:39:39,871 So, I would say for one, you're, you're not doing this for yourself. 754 00:39:39,871 --> 00:39:40,741 You're doing this for your. 755 00:39:41,581 --> 00:39:44,521 Number two is you're gonna get a team of men involved. 756 00:39:45,031 --> 00:39:49,861 And three, really the benefit of it is that you are, by affirming your 757 00:39:49,861 --> 00:39:54,721 son's masculine identity, you are showing him that he does not have to 758 00:39:54,721 --> 00:39:57,001 prove his manhood to himself, right. 759 00:39:57,481 --> 00:39:59,821 Through rebelling, through doing dangerous stunts. 760 00:40:00,451 --> 00:40:03,601 And so that's what the, the benefit of the weekend for your 761 00:40:03,601 --> 00:40:05,071 son is that you're giving him a. 762 00:40:06,046 --> 00:40:10,096 Moment that he can look back on and say, that was the weekend when I 763 00:40:10,096 --> 00:40:12,016 became a man in my father's eyes. 764 00:40:13,186 --> 00:40:15,616 Stephen, what is the most important takeaway you want people 765 00:40:15,616 --> 00:40:16,726 to hear from this show today? 766 00:40:18,796 --> 00:40:23,326 The most important takeaway that I want people to take away from this show is 767 00:40:23,331 --> 00:40:28,926 that in the absence of Rite of Passage, boys are gonna prove their manhood to the. 768 00:40:29,701 --> 00:40:34,591 And that's why it's every father's responsibility because he is the 769 00:40:34,591 --> 00:40:38,491 primary example of what it means to be a man in a boy's life. 770 00:40:38,911 --> 00:40:43,231 It's every father's responsibility to tell his son at the appropriate age. 771 00:40:43,591 --> 00:40:49,111 Son, I just want you to know I no longer consider you to be a boy, but in my eyes, 772 00:40:49,201 --> 00:40:53,701 I see you as a man now and that if every father in this country did that for their. 773 00:40:54,796 --> 00:40:57,886 Than this country and this world would be a much better place 774 00:40:57,886 --> 00:41:02,146 because boys would not need to prove their manhood to anybody else. 775 00:41:03,826 --> 00:41:04,846 What's next for Steven Arm? 776 00:41:07,216 --> 00:41:08,296 That's a great question. 777 00:41:08,363 --> 00:41:09,366 What's next for me? 778 00:41:09,636 --> 00:41:13,478 My wife and I are expecting our third child this year, so that's 779 00:41:13,718 --> 00:41:14,828 definitely the biggest things. 780 00:41:15,218 --> 00:41:15,698 Thank you. 781 00:41:15,818 --> 00:41:17,828 That's definitely the biggest thing on our minds. 782 00:41:17,962 --> 00:41:19,162 That and just getting. 783 00:41:20,272 --> 00:41:24,682 Idea of a rite of passage out into the world, sharing it with other families 784 00:41:24,682 --> 00:41:28,912 so that they can benefit from the weekend in the same way that ours has. 785 00:41:29,902 --> 00:41:30,202 Right. 786 00:41:30,892 --> 00:41:30,982 And 787 00:41:30,982 --> 00:41:37,282 guys, I will have a link to their website in the show notes and in the 788 00:41:37,287 --> 00:41:38,962 description so you can find the book. 789 00:41:39,262 --> 00:41:40,952 So you can go find those letters. 790 00:41:40,952 --> 00:41:44,975 We'll make sure you guys are hooked up with milestone to manhood.com. 791 00:41:45,875 --> 00:41:47,555 Also, if you go to. 792 00:41:48,260 --> 00:41:51,260 Bookshelf on our library, on the website, you'll find a link to their 793 00:41:51,260 --> 00:41:54,350 book If you are interested in getting this book as well, you can get it on 794 00:41:54,350 --> 00:41:58,580 their site, you can get on Amazon, whatever is good for you guys, and 795 00:41:58,585 --> 00:42:01,850 that link will stay up there because I think this book has a lot of value. 796 00:42:02,210 --> 00:42:05,855 If you are a father looking and working on setting an example, and 797 00:42:05,960 --> 00:42:08,990 I'm assuming you are because you're listening to this show, right? 798 00:42:08,990 --> 00:42:10,550 And this is what we're all about here. 799 00:42:11,030 --> 00:42:14,480 So if this is what something you're looking for, I wholeheartedly 800 00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:16,310 recommend pick up copy of this. 801 00:42:16,310 --> 00:42:18,075 I'm actually loaning my copy to people. 802 00:42:18,075 --> 00:42:20,625 I'm like making a list of people I'm handing it to. 803 00:42:21,105 --> 00:42:24,525 Now that I'm done with it, guys, I would highly encourage you to pick this 804 00:42:24,525 --> 00:42:28,755 up and consider this whether you have boys or whether you have girls, because 805 00:42:29,055 --> 00:42:32,625 until we get the book for girls, you can actually change a lot of this over. 806 00:42:32,685 --> 00:42:36,325 And ladies, you can pick it up too cuz we have a lot of ladies that listen to this 807 00:42:36,330 --> 00:42:41,265 show and get the baseline for how you can do this with your daughters as well. 808 00:42:43,935 --> 00:42:44,445 Give it a try. 809 00:42:44,475 --> 00:42:44,775 Trust. 810 00:42:44,775 --> 00:42:45,345 Trust me there. 811 00:42:45,345 --> 00:42:46,335 There are books you need to read. 812 00:42:46,335 --> 00:42:47,175 You should read this one. 813 00:42:47,415 --> 00:42:50,385 Steven, thank you for taking the time to be here with us today 814 00:42:50,385 --> 00:42:51,735 and to share with our audience. 815 00:42:52,305 --> 00:42:55,335 It's been great having you on, guys, as always. 816 00:42:55,340 --> 00:42:58,275 Be better tomorrow because of what you do today and we'll see you on the next one. 817 00:42:59,745 --> 00:43:02,205 This has been the Fallible Man Podcast. 818 00:43:02,835 --> 00:43:06,105 Your home for everything, man, husband, and father. 819 00:43:06,975 --> 00:43:09,255 Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss a show. 820 00:43:10,125 --> 00:43:16,485 Head over to www.thefallibleman.com for more content and get 821 00:43:16,485 --> 00:43:18,015 your own Fallible man gear.

Steven ArmsProfile Photo

Steven Arms

Author

Making the leap from boyhood to manhood is the most important transition that your son will make. His happiness, self-confidence, and future marriage all depend on successfully navigating his teenage years. As fathers, we can either sit by as our sons stumble over their own mistakes, or we can lovingly share our experiences with them to help them build lives of purpose and meaning.​

In the past, societies from around the world held initiation events to mark the transition from boyhood to manhood. These gatherings created a situation where elders could bestow the “knowledge of life” and “family values” with the younger generation. This helped keep the tribe alive and well cared for.

To our sons’ detriment, modern society does not offer a similar coming-of-age ceremony today.

For that reason, our family has celebrated a special birthday weekend to welcome our thirteen-year-old boys into manhood. We held these celebrations to make it clear to them the exact moment that they became a man so they didn’t have to go through their teens and twenties wondering when manhood would finally “kick in.”

We called this weekend their Rite of Passage.

Steven Arms experienced one of these Rite of Passage weekends when he turned thirteen, and now he wants to share it with other families as well. He will give a firsthand account of his ROP weekend, explain the rituals behind the event, and give fathers the tools needed to organize a Rite of Passage for their own sons.